Cleaning Business Life

CBL Episode #71-The Power of No: Establishing Boundaries and Prioritizing Self-Care in Your Cleaning Business

• Shannon Miller and Kimberly Gonzales • Season 2024 • Episode 71

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Ever felt the overwhelming pressure to say yes to every request, only to find yourself on the brink of burnout? Shannon and I share our personal journeys of learning to say no, a skill that's especially challenging for women often expected to be caregivers and people-pleasers. We'll share strategies for setting boundaries in both business and personal life, including real-life scenarios that illustrate how crucial it is to protect your time and well-being. Our discussion includes valuable insights from the book "Boundaries," helping you navigate the temptation to respond to work messages at all hours and keep your professional life from bleeding into your personal time.

Running a cleaning business brings its own set of challenges, especially when it comes to last-minute client requests and the dangers of overcommitting. We talk about the importance of maintaining high standards, even under pressure, and why charging higher rates for emergency jobs isn't just fair—it's necessary. Shannon and I also tackle the tough conversations around managing demanding clients and setting clear, non-negotiable boundaries. Listen in for practical advice on maintaining professionalism and prioritizing self-care, ensuring that your mental well-being and business success go hand-in-hand.

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Shannon Miller: cleaningbusinesslife@gmail.com

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Speaker 1:

recording in progress kim kimberly gonzalez, inventor extraordinaire. My name is shannon miller and I'm your host of cleaning business life, and I'm joined by my wonderful co-host, kimberly gonzalez.

Speaker 2:

Inventor extraordinaire, kim, take it away hey, everybody, welcome back if you guys are listening. I just want to say thank you to the people in our group that have done shout outs about our podcast. You guys, it means a lot Like. We truly love it. Tag us like at you can do a little at sign but text Shannon and I and we love seeing that. It just makes our day and it fills our cup. I hope you guys know that. So thank you guys for just bragging about us. We need it Today. I love this one. This one was fun to write. We write notes, you guys, because I have ADHD, Shannon do you have ADHD, I have moments where I have moments.

Speaker 2:

You have your squirrel moments.

Speaker 1:

Right, I'm like, oh.

Speaker 2:

So we do keep notes because for me, I have to be focused, I have to be like, know where I'm going to be at, and it helps me so I'm not jumping all over the place. But today we're talking about the power of no, and I love this one. It is very fun just to type up and just really insightful, and I finally learned the power of no when I hit my thirties and I'm still working on it. It's a, it's a work in progress saying the word no. So we're going to dive in the crucial topic for learning to say no in your business and in your personal life, because it's hard to do. Um, so let's get started.

Speaker 2:

So, shannon, you know you and I have done this. We're guilty of it. I'm sure you guys are guilty of it. You know I get messages. You know seven, eight o'clock at night. So have you guys ever taken messages off Facebook or Instagram, or you've received text messages late at night, or even during dinner or after dinner? What about phone calls? I know you guys have all done it. So if you say you have not, you guys are lying. I know you guys have all done it.

Speaker 1:

So if you say you have not, you guys are lying. I got one at 8.55 and wanted to know if I can get a quote for cleaning services. No, I'm not going to give you a quote at nine o'clock. Can you say that word again? No, no, it was tempting because I was like, oh, it'll take really quick time, but they're going to have to wait until actually later today when I catch up on all those things.

Speaker 1:

It's hard. As women, we are meant to be caregivers. That's what we're groomed and conditioned for. In any society, the woman is the nurturer, the provider of the hugs and kisses and whatever else goes on. So it's really hard for us to say no.

Speaker 1:

But as business cleaning business entrepreneurs and business owners, it's probably the most important habit you can learn to do is saying no. I say no all the time and I'm ruthless about it. You know why? It's because people will take advantage of you, because they think that, because we're people pleasers and we're women and then we're low on the totem pole still, even though we're essential that they can just treat us poorly. So you have the right to say no.

Speaker 1:

Just like other merchants have the right to refuse services, we have the right to refuse service, to blah, blah, blah. We've all seen the notice. You have the right to say no and it's okay. Now, sometimes it's a polite no and sometimes it's not polite. I say that with my eyebrows, you know, really high, but it's true. Unfortunately we have and Kim and I have mentioned this thousands of times. Probably we'll mention it thousands more we have become a society that thinks that we're entitled to everything for free and it's here and now. Or they want it now or they're going to ruin you. I'm going to ruin you and you're just like where?

Speaker 2:

Why don't you get back to me right now? I needed, I needed to know this like 10 minutes ago, and where are you? And why haven't?

Speaker 1:

you procrastinated and waited until after hours and no one's going to respond to that chamber box, the echo, echo, echo.

Speaker 2:

That's where boundaries comes into place. There's a book, Shannon. Do you have that book too?

Speaker 1:

Boundaries- I believe I do somewhere. I know.

Speaker 2:

I have it. I'm staring at it right now.

Speaker 1:

Right.

Speaker 2:

I do have it somewhere, but I'm pretty sure I have a, at least a book. Um, there's a book called boundaries and it is a really good book. I highly recommend it. I'm not a reader. Shannon knows I do not read. I struggle with reading. I have since I was little, probably because my ADHD wants to go all over the place. But boundaries really grabbed my attention and it taught me a lot. I've read it once, not once, but twice. I've read it twice. Oh, good book. I know the fact that I can read a book twice is huge for me, you guys. So if I say I read a book twice, you know it's good, it's camera proofed, but it's a good book to add to your collection. So I'm going to do a scenario. Hey, I'm going to do a scenario.

Speaker 1:

I wish we had music to do this. Okay, I'm going to act.

Speaker 2:

I'm going to act. This is my acting skills. You guys Imagine this A client calls you late at night demanding a last-minute deep clean because their in-laws are coming into town. Let's go, ooh and ah Ready. Ooh and ah, ooh, ah, ooh, ah. You feel the pressure to say yes because you want to keep that client happy. But what if you said no Pause for effect? Do you like how I did that? Saying no to the situation isn't declining a job. It's just about protecting your guys' time. It's protecting your team's time. It's maintaining the quality of your guys' services. When you constantly are saying yes, yes, yes, yes to everything, you get burnout. How many of you guys have done this, shannon? You can raise your hand. I know you have too. I have done it too. I say yes, yes, yes. I don't put those boundaries in place and I get burnout. And when you get burnout, you don't function well, you're tired, you get grumpy, you snap at people, your work goes downhill and then there's the resentment. So it's a whole spiral that happens.

Speaker 1:

And sometimes, when you get better, you can feel it coming on and you're like, okay, it's time for me to step back, because we're constantly, we're constantly on the go as entrepreneurs. It's, it's every we have 50 different angles that people come at us and then you're responsible for checking your voicemail. You're responsible for checking your messages, your TikTok messages, your Instagram messages, your business profile messages. I mean, there's, there's just stuff coming at you all the time and it just comes to a point where you have to just say no, especially when it comes time with my littles. They're eight and nine. They're not going to be eight and nine forever. So when we have the group, time is what I call it, because once in a while we're lucky enough to have individual. You know how it goes. I don't let anyone cut into that time. We're there to spend time as a family. Sometimes my husband gets a chance to join, sometimes he doesn't, but the three of us were like the. You know, the three musketeers were constantly doing things together, and that's important to me. Do what's important for you and your family, but don't let people cut in. I mean the person at nine o'clock at night texting me, wanting to know if I did house cleaning and if I, you know, I'm like give me a break or they procrastinate. Well, we've known we're going to close on such and such a date. I guess I just now remembered.

Speaker 1:

I personally think that if you're a real estate agent, you should have a checklist of all the things that you need to accomplish after you sign the paperwork and you're waiting for everything to close, to include cleaning, on it. Why doesn't someone invent that, so that contact your local cleaning company to schedule blah, blah, blah, blah In the move out cleaning masterclass there is a checklist that you can give to your clients. But why don't real estate agents do that, that and tell them where their main shutoff line is? Nobody knows where that is in your house and what was the other important thing that you should know as a homeowner? There was one other thing they should tell you. I can't think of it off the top of my head. Yeah, I don't remember. Um, turn off the water is important as well, but that's off track. I apologize.

Speaker 2:

Um, go ahead, no, I was going to say too, when we we, when we're trying to say no, like there's sometimes like for us ADHD people brains if I know that I need to contact somebody and it's late at night, I get my little. I have a notebook. So this is how I keep myself organized. I actually go out and just get notebooks and I do my little to-do list. So if, at the moment, if it's at nine o'clock at night and I'm like remembering something but I don't want to text that person that late, I write it on my little list so I don't forget, because my brain's going to forget. I'll have my scroll moment and I'll forget and I'll go off and then I'll like shoot. So you know that's a good way to do it. If you guys are those people too that like sometimes catch yourself going and texting people late at night for a business, write it down If you don't forget. That's my little secret.

Speaker 1:

Definitely writing things down is important. Or if you can't remember, you can do a reminder in your Google calendar and it'll send you a reminder to do. Sometimes it takes a practice, practice, practice. It took me forever, yeah, teaching old dog new tricks. Right, it's just like forever, but I do. Pen to paper is probably my, my favorite.

Speaker 2:

So it's like how do you say no without damaging relationships or feeling guilty? We're going to teach you guys that today so the first one is being polite but firm. That today so the first one is being polite but firm you could still. You could still be polite and be firm at the same time. So you know, when you take that, when you want to be respected too because it comes into being respected you could say something like I'm sorry, we're fully booked this week, but can we schedule you for next week instead? Or be polite but give them an option, so you're still being firm. What's the second one?

Speaker 1:

Shannon, um, um suggest an alternative for what they're asking. Sometimes people have unrealistic expectations of what can be done. How many times have people told us well, I need to move out clean. It's just a sweep. Just a sweep and a quick dust Red flag going right there. I had a woman on the phone, or she. She moved down to Phoenix and she now is requiring service down there, but her sister wanted to get in on the action, so she actually had a move out cleaning scheduled. So she didn't tell me this. I found this out after I quoted her what my initial starting price was and she started yelling at me over the phone and I was just like shocked that this person first was yelling at me.

Speaker 1:

So she's yelling at me how she's going to clean this cleaning tech. She wanted to know if she could get the cleaning because someone promised her a move out cleaning for 200 bucks. So she was looking for a cheaper price less than the $200. I started laughing and it was awkward between the customer and myself. I'm like I'm really sorry if I offended your sister. She goes oh, don't worry about it, she's super cheap. And blah, blah, blah. I was like why did you put me on the phone with her? It's just, yeah, the alternative is just trying to offer a realistic expectation of, um, what those boundaries are?

Speaker 1:

We all know that you cannot do a move out cleaning in four hours. With two people you might be able to, depending on the size and scope, but as a solo person, no, it's usually an eight hour thing. I've done enough of them to know and explain your reasons. Sometimes you can explain the why. Sometimes I don't want to hear and they'll just go click and I'm like God, when did it become so rude? Like I guess the conversation's over. Especially this month I've had like 10 people just mid sentence hang up the phone on me. That's terrible.

Speaker 2:

My husband doesn't even answer the phone.

Speaker 1:

That's his solution my husband doesn't even answer the phone. That's his solution, right? I've actually gotten to the point now because I'm getting I literally get 100 phone calls every day. 99 of them are telemarketing calls, or I'll get, you know, 70 marketing calls and 30 regular calls, and I'll thank god. But it makes me afraid to pick up the phone because I don't. I, I don't have any back taxes, I don't need an extended warranty, there's nothing wrong. But I think they just hit me every day on all, both lines. So I'll let it go to voicemail and if it's legit then I'll call them back right away. But I'm just like I hate to do it.

Speaker 2:

You know what I've done. I've just called them back and like, I call them back and then they answer and they're all confused because they're like what the heck? This person just called me back, like you know they expect it, and I was like, can you just take me off my ear list please? Well, I haven't pressed the button. Hopefully I've noticed some calls go down since I've been doing it.

Speaker 1:

Okay, If there's some secret formula for getting rid of these people, let me know, Because I just I had one person argue with me over her right to give me the telemarketing calls. I'm like is this, is this real? I?

Speaker 2:

don't know, I'm still getting calls for like five to zero and I'm like I don't even live there anymore. Right, it's just wild. It's an area code for Tucson, you guys it is.

Speaker 1:

It's way, way down South. Four hours for me, sometimes explaining why you're you can know how client help. Way down south Four hours for me, sometimes explaining why you can not help clients. So people can understand your perspective. We want to make sure you provide this most graceful service provided, and squeezing an extra job in it ruins the quality of work. And we've seen this happen, where they give you the pleading heart story, you're like, okay, I'll just fit one more in, and then it's a total shit show and everything goes wrong. And then they want to argue with you and you didn't bother to get a deposit, you didn't get a contract signed it. And then you have 16 hours of labor and they're like see you later, thanks for not cleaning or cleaning my stuff.

Speaker 1:

We've become a society where people will overstep, so don't take on extra jobs. Your crew just probably is pooped out and you want everything to be timed and intentional. And when you take on a last minute emergency clean, it should be three times the normal rate if you have room on your schedule and there needs to be conditions that are followed, and if they can't follow those conditions, then they don't get to have an emergency cleaning. Regardless of my cleaner did this, my cleaner did that, or we forgot, or whatever. Don't play into the victimhood that the home. What is the word you need to say? Just say no, because it's a shit show. Yeah exactly.

Speaker 2:

He's like like just say no and just because it's a shit show, right.

Speaker 1:

So I have to blurt that out say, um, I think if you would just put explicit it's okay, um, at least the rules of that haven't changed yet that I know of. So making sure that you are making conscious, good decisions for your baby. The whole point of making this becoming a cleaning business entrepreneur, creating a business, building it so it's to either you know long-term legacy, where you just get a paycheck quarterly, or to sell or gift to your family. You're creating something. This is your golden goose. So when you take on last minute cleans is usually when I get a phone call from somebody and I'm like, oh no, and then we have to backpedal and try to get you paid. So make sure that you are not doing that to yourself. It's like shooting yourself in the foot.

Speaker 2:

Exactly Having set clear policies. You guys, we, shannon I don't even know how many times we have said this, probably every day to people Having those clear, written policies put in place is so important, you guys, because it shows that this is your standard, these are your rules, these are your expectations. This is what you have to follow. A lot of companies require 48 hours for last minute notices for jobs. Some require more because, again, like what Shannon said, how are you going to be able to fit them in to make those demands?

Speaker 1:

And when your crew is tired, they're not going to perform to maximum capacity. So unless you have a fresh crew that didn't go out, I would not recommend taking on emergency cleaning.

Speaker 2:

Exactly and, like I said, charge triple that amount. Set your hours, you guys, and stick to them. I'm very I love my hours, um, I have. The way I set my schedule up is that I time block a lot of things. I know that I have to time block. So even if it's like 15 minutes working on this and then I come back to it 15 minutes later, you know down in the afternoon, set your hours, you guys, and stick to them. So if you want to go to the gym in the morning time, block that time off and use that time for going to the gym, stick to that and then you can go to work after that. If your hours are from, you know, eight to five, stick to that eight to five time.

Speaker 2:

Don't answer messages after five o'clock. Schedule yourself in time for doing emails. So let's say you do emails in the morning for 15 minutes and 15 minutes in the afternoon. I just had Sarah put something up on my email that was an auto response and so if you were to email me, an auto response comes up and it says thank you so much for emailing me. I value you guys and I will get back to you. I have set hours that I checked my emails so I promise you I did not forget about you and I will get back to you. I have set hours, that I checked my emails so I promise you I did not forget about you and I will get back to you. So I put that in place to like put that boundary up so they know that I'm still gonna get back to them, but it really freed up and just really like gave me that breathing room. So setting those hours and sticking to them.

Speaker 1:

Definitely and then typically when you take on last minute cleans. The expectation is just unrealistic every single time and you don't have time to vet them. You're not listening to the nuances in the conversation. All you're doing is trying to do a good deed and you're going to be punished for it. So make sure that you are clear when you decide to take one on and then practicing self-care.

Speaker 1:

You guys hear us talk about all self-care. It's not selfish. I heard that someone another mentor said that to me the other day. Self-care is not selfish. Remember that it's when you provide care for yourself. It gives you the opportunity to get some respite so that you can help care for others. So there's a lot of things that you can do to give yourself self-care. We've mentioned them in the past and your well-being is really critical to your success. When you are under stress, you release a hormone and it causes all kinds of it doesn't make you sleep, makes you gain weight, it makes you irritable, your attention span is really short. No one wants to be around you. So make sure that you are providing some sort of self-care to yourself, whatever.

Speaker 1:

Whatever it is that you choose to give yourself care to like you know, a vacation or whatever reward, that is that you have a wine at night, or a glass of wine at night, or not every night, but a glass of wine, right?

Speaker 2:

You won't be able to run your company effectively If you have a whole bottle of wine like I'm taking my self care and for my lunch, and then you come back and you're like three drinks later, three mimosas later.

Speaker 1:

You don't want to do that, and then I won't tell anybody. Right Speaking from experience.

Speaker 1:

Right, I worked for the Metropolitan Museum of Art and there was a Mexican restaurant around the corner and then when we knew when the big boss was coming, my boss and myself we would go and have little Larry's they were like little teeny margaritas before he would come, cause he would just give everybody anxiety. And finally, after watching my boss have like a full on melt meltdown before he came, I'm like let's go around the corner. And she's like I can't believe we're gonna do this. I'm like you've got to. I gotta calm you down. I'm not gonna be able to get through what we need to get through and I'm not a big person or an advocate for drinking on the job, but it was just like it just took the edge off. She just needed. I couldn't get her to like. So we we're going to revert to the you know the good old standard of a margarita. But yeah, she was, she was. I helped her answer she didn't. It didn't affect her, but it was. It made things calmer and we actually ended up getting a better story review than we would had had I not intervened.

Speaker 1:

And then dealing with pushback is the condescending tone of people telling you that no, I need you to do this now. I want you to do this now. If you don't do this now, I'm going to punish you and it's like that's a whole parent-child relationship. You need to switch that up and make sure that it's not a parent-child relationship. You're two adults. It's a business and a consumer relationship. Business and consumer relationships have boundaries. There's cordialness, there's expectation that you're going to be polite and that you're not going to grab everything and run away with it like a hermit. And staying calm Some days you're better at this than others. We all have our moments Is keeping when you're calm. It's helping to keep your emotions in check. Professional demeanor helps diffuse tension, unless you're on a United flight acting really naughty. We've seen all those videos on the news. I don't know what they're doing with those poor people who, and the flight attendants on United. United has just gotten themselves into a little bit of a hole when it comes to customer service. It's just like wow, wow.

Speaker 2:

I feel like when I start feeling like emotions are building up, I just want to take a step back because people can read you, they can sense it in your tone. I think it just like excretes from your body, like your body language is just body language. It's just staying calm. If that means you have to go outside and take a couple of breaths, like just that has helped me like big time. And I've had to learn a lot of this, like when I was dealing with my ex-husband. I've had to learn to stay calm in front of my kids.

Speaker 1:

That's not always easy to do, I'm telling you.

Speaker 2:

That's when the, that's when the mimosas came in handy before Don't take us the wrong way.

Speaker 1:

We're not condoning this type of no, we're not, we're just, we're just making fun of our experiences that we've had. We're not, we cannot walk on water. We probably never will achieve it, but we do try to strive and be conscientious. And you know, just throwing it out there in case someone gives us hate mail and then reiterating your policies, I am really sorry. I have a very. That's what it says in my paperwork. I have a very stringent 48 hour cancellation policy. It states this blah, blah, blah, blah, blah, blah, blah. If you have an issue with this or if you have questions regarding said policy, please reach out to the office. We're happy to chat with you and usually when you explain, you know why you have a 48 hour policy. It's because you want to have someone fill that spot. The cleaning tech is anticipating on those hours and they've already rearranged their whole schedule for that. So they want to make sure that you are going to be okay with what is going to go down and then standing firm if a client continues to push.

Speaker 1:

I've had a lot of really weird things happen to me this year with clients being over the mark. Let's say where they. You know, I had one guy who wanted to have a maid come clean his house and then he then he casually mentioned that he wanted to be nude for that. And I'm like what we can talk about naked maids and everything else on another podcast, but it you, you just they overstepped, that's, that's an automatically a red flag. The guy's overstepped and he could say it is, I'm just letting you know I'm being forward, blah, blah, nobody, nobody wants, nobody appreciates that, nobody wants to see it. And'm just letting you know I'm being forward blah, blah, blah. Nobody appreciates that, nobody wants to see it. And I appreciate the candor, but we're not interested in those types of cleanings ever.

Speaker 1:

But you have to be able to push back politely and then sometimes you just say you know, and I've had to say it, I'm really sorry, I just don't think that we are a good fit for what you are looking for at this time. If that should change, please feel free to give me a call back. Boom, and you have to. Sometimes you have to hang up the phone on them because they will go. Did you hang up the phone to me and you could just say yes, but these are the ways to work past the anger. Don't be triggered, don't take it personal and just keep on marching on. That's what I've said to people on multiple occasions, especially this last year. I don't think we're going to be a good fit. You mean, you're telling me no, yes, I'm telling you no, no, no no, no.

Speaker 2:

And I've had some clients that I've just kept pushing back, pushing back, and that was just to me. I was like, okay, I'm done, I'm done. It's not worth it, you guys. It's not worth it to get yourself upset, it's not worth it dealing with those clients because you will fill that spot. And I always have people say I'm worried, I'm not going to fill that spot, I need the money. It will come, you guys, it will come.

Speaker 1:

It will come and I will, and I've mentioned this before. Dan Kennedy, who is the godfather of ad copy for print, had. In one of his books I read he gave an example of refunding someone who just wasn't his client. And this might be crass to some of you and I'm not meaning to offend, but basically he said that he, if he takes on a client and he goes to bed at night and he is still thinking about you and they, that he is not sleeping with you, then you don't deserve that space in his head and that time. So subsequently he's going to give that money back and he has.

Speaker 1:

He said he gave back like a $50,000 check one time because he had a female that was just over the top who couldn't manage herself and she was consuming too much of his personal time and it was just like this and it just stuck with me. I'm like, oh that that that story is a little, you know, ooh, but it gets the point across that if people are too much time in your free time, with your space, with your family and we've all done it I mean, how many times have we gotten yelled at by a client? And you're at dinner going? I really should be enjoying this, and this really sucks and it ruins your mood for the rest of the dinner.

Speaker 2:

And then you're like and you're like grumpy with your husband, you're going to be with your kids, you're short the kids, so it kind of rubs off and you guys don't need to do that.

Speaker 1:

So no, it's not worth it. We're all here a very short amount of time. Enjoy and cherish those moments. And then seeking support that's what the group's for. Seeking support, venting, seeking advice from a mentor or business coach or someone that you do that I always recommend that you do that. You never know when you might need help from your, your neighbor right.

Speaker 2:

Or just even venting and say how can I reword this? Like reach out to somebody that's good with words. How can I reword this? What would be a better way for me to reword this? Or speak to this person Like can you help me out with that? That's a great way to do that. How can you hold me accountable to say no?

Speaker 1:

Right, and sometimes it's really simple because you're not emotionally involved, the other person isn't, so they can just go. Okay, this is what you need to say, because we do, we do, we tend to, we don't mean to, we take it personal. This is like an insult to me. I can't believe that you said those things to me and you're just like so you need someone from the outside to go. Okay, this is what you need to say. And then or they look at the response, like okay, you need to remove that one, we need to rewrite it.

Speaker 2:

Yeah, cause when you're angry or upset, you're going to write stuff that you don't want to say, and so asking somebody to reread it and letting them look at it and asking them for their feedback is important. I've had a lot of people do that for me. When I get reviews, sometimes I'll have Amy go and read the review and then I will have her respond. So I'm taking myself out of that situation. So that's when it's come in handy for having Amy around for that.

Speaker 1:

Definitely. Sometimes I have my mom do it. I'm like do you have a second? My mom's my biggest cheerleader. I love her. She's almost 80. Learning to say no is a vital skill for any business and cleaning business owner, cleaning business entrepreneur. It's about maintaining the quality of your services, protecting your time, ensuring the sustainability of your business.

Speaker 2:

Remember, every time you say no to something that doesn't align with your goals or capacity, you're saying yes to something that does and I'm a big believer that you know, you guys, I'm a big believer in saying, when you say no, that you are saying yes to something else. That's huge. That has really hit home for me this past year.

Speaker 1:

Definitely. Thanks for tuning in to Cleaning Business Life If you enjoyed this episode. I'm still practicing on my notes here. You can see them. You're good.

Speaker 2:

You stayed on task today.

Speaker 1:

Be sure and leave a review, download and remember to ask questions. That's all new we talked about in the last episode. And remember saying no can be the key to more successful and fulfilling business. Until next time, keep it clean and keep it successful that's fun writing, thanks.

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Shannon Miller

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